Conversations and Thoughts on Worship

A cool post...

2009-07-30T10:48:00.002-04:00

from Be the Change Project.

Quick, Costume Change!
Bill Couchenour - Thursday, July 02, 2009
by Erik Bennett & Josh Shank

Have you ever tried to convince a group of people they need to be in community with each other? If you tried this from the pulpit it was probably a well-crafted and biblically sound appeal. So, how are they doing? Did biblical community arise out of the ashes of your speech? Most of us have to answer with a resounding “No!”

I have seen two answers to this predicament. The first way tries to go back to the Christian community in Acts like a civil war re-enactment costume. People who wear this costume are committed to fine details that secure authenticity. One’s attire must be impeccable in order to participate. In reality, no person today can transform their internal make-up to match that of the people who really lived through the civil war.

We can research and work hard at it but we cannot truly recreate a civil war soldier in the 21st century. We are playing dress up. This is just like the Pharisees of Jesus’ day. We are only dressing up the outside and trying to be just like the community of the past and it doesn’t work.

The second way involves subtle fear, a costume that is harder to describe. Have you ever been at a costume party where there’s that one guy that looks normal except for some weird accessory like a hat, cane, or basketball? You ask him who he is supposed to be and he says, “I’m Lebron James” (at this point he holds up the basketball). The truth is this guy didn’t know what to wear! He was too scared to risk the transformation a costume brings. So, he doesn’t even try. Lame-costume-Christians are afraid of failing so they don’t even try. This kind of costume is becoming more prominent in our post-modern, post-Christian, post-trying culture.

Often we just stop proclaiming the truth because we are afraid of failing or looking stupid. This was the mode of life for me and my other twentysomething peers in college. We used Francis of Assisi (his quote about preaching the gospel but only using words when necessary) as a shield against feeling stupid. We were afraid of trying to be a Christian and falling short. The best answer seemed to be to stop telling people we were Christians. We adopted spiritual language full of mystery and God but missing Jesus. There is something about using his name that changes the conversation... and we were afraid of that change.

How do you begin authentic biblical community? Do you wait until you are the perfect example of a first century Christian? Or, maybe you realize you never will and have given up. Neither costume is the clothing Christ has required. Put simply, the attire required is humility and the willingness to step out. Are these clothes the most comfortable? No. Are these clothes the most beautiful? No. But, in the end, these are the clothes of Christ.

Prayer

2009-05-22T14:11:00.004-04:00

"Have you noticed how some people talk in normal voices until the moment they begin to pray? Then they'll suddenly lower their voices to a whisper. This is, I suppose, a way to show reverence and respect, the way you might talk to a king or a president whom you fear. Although this may be an appropriate way to approach God at times, it seems like this is the way you approach a father who's waiting to give you a smack with a wooden spoon, not a father who's going to hug you, wrap you in the finest cloak, and throw you a banquet." - Tony Jones, Praying the Bible - The Wrestling of Lectio Divina.

As I mentioned previously on another blog, I have been thinking about prayer lately. I've been reading Shane Claiborne's book Becoming the Answer to Our Prayers, it basically covers three prayers within scripture: Kingdom Prayer (the Lord's Prayer-Matthew 6:9-13), Jesus' Prayer 'that they may be one' in John 17, and Paul's prayer for the Ephesians. In each of these prayers Shane and his coauthor Jonathan Wilson-Hartgrove write about the significance of these prayers and how each calls us to intimate relationship with our heavenly Father and seeks to move us out as part of God's answer to the prayers we pray.

So what have I been thinking and how does it relate to Tony Jones' quote? Well, one of the significant ideas within Kingdom Prayer is addressing God as our heavenly Father. Of course, heavenly points to the mystery of God, that God is different from us, but the word Father, which in Aramaic is more accurately translated to 'daddy' or 'pappa' speaks of our relationship with this God. Father is a very relational term. Tony Jones brings this to light as he says, "...it seems like this is the way you approach a father who's waiting to give you a smack with a wooden spoon, not a father who's going to hug you, wrap you in the finest cloak, and throw you a banquet."

What if when we pray we begin by seeing God with the biblical images of father that Jesus presented to us? What if when we pray we begin by recognizing that this father is the father who is going to hug you, wrap you in the finest cloak even after you squandered your inheritance and this father throws you a banquet in your honor?

This vision of God our father that Jesus speaks of is truly revolutionary.

Here's a visual thought...

2009-04-23T09:39:00.009-04:00

Thank you Scott for sharing this during a New Hope gathering.

So what am I trying to say?
Please don't misunderstand me. Gathering together for praising God, encouraging one another, prayer, teaching and learning about God is vital to being a healthy follower of Jesus. But worship is so much more than that... it's so much more than a song as Matt Redman wrote in a song 'The Heart of Worship'. Worship is a 24-7-365 kind of thing.

An example: Worship is when I was sitting in my living room, drinking coffee, watching Elmo, taking a glimpse through the crack in the curtains that my cats use to see out the window and seeing through the glass and sunshine to my neighbors blooming yellow flowers, all the while holding my son in my arms, loving him as he gently became tired enough to fall asleep.

When we define 'worship' as what we do on Sunday morning or when we sing with a group of people, we are missing out on the fullness of Beauty in God's creation. Every moment that we live and breath, whether being born or even dying is connected to worship. Jesus is the beginning and the end. It's through him that all things are made and it is to him that all things will be found.

May we worship God more fully in our every day life.

As a curious project... when you have a moment of inspiration or worship or just the recognition that everything is somehow spiritual and interconnected wouldn't it be cool if we had a place to post it.

God is here, wherever we are and wherever we are not.

While We Are Waiting for a Direction from God

2009-02-10T10:38:00.004-05:00

I find meaning in this song. I have been in a time of 'in between'. I have been waiting for the right moment, or the right word from God. Waiting for things to fall into place. It's funny because I don't find myself as superstitious, but it seems that this practice of seeking God's will is sometimes that. This song helps with those times. It asks the question, "what am I going to do while I wait?" and "what might I do in the in between?" and "how might I instill value into now?" It's not about being busy to be busy. It's about continuing the way of Jesus even in times of waiting. It's about loving my neighbor and my enemy. It's about not getting overly bent out of shape because life isn't going 'my way.' It's about stepping forward with the building of character, so that we might be stronger when difficult times may come.

Anyway, I hope you enjoy the song.

From Story by Steven James

2008-06-29T13:33:00.002-04:00

"Theology is the greatest threat to spiritual pilgrims when it becomes the game of defining God and gets in the way of letting god define you" (89).

Ben's Working Definition of Preaching

2008-06-24T10:32:00.003-04:00

Preaching is not for preachers...

Preaching is the priesthood of all believers.
~ It's when we live, we love and relate to the world in ways that make this place a better a place.
~ It's when people feel valued and loved.
~ It's when people see that our actions (as disciples of Christ, followers of God's way in the world) speak to the reality of how God created things and us to be.
~ It's a way of living that connects who God is and ultimate reality (of how God intends the world and us to be).

I will need to write more about this later... this is only the beginning of a collage of thought.

Worship Leader Magazine Reconsidered

2008-06-18T20:20:00.002-04:00

Now, I just want to start by saying that I like, have enjoyed and have grown in my understanding of worship through Worship Leader Magazine. In many ways I have been formed by articles that I have read over the past ten years. However, recently, I am becoming more and more skeptical.

My views have changed... I no longer view worship as music or congregational singing. Worship is really, truly what we do with our every day... day to day lives... moment by moment lives (247365). Worship is how I treat my coworker... worship is how I treat my family... worship might just be how I drive my car on the way to work. Worship is loving God and loving my neighbor. May be it is even better said... worship is loving God through loving my neighbor.

I think many of us are afraid of this kind of definition of worship... why? because we know we don't live up to the standard... it's so much easier to call worship what we do when we gather with a bunch of Christians on Sunday morning (may be saturday evening) and sing songs. It's easier... God would have to be more pleased with that than the rest of our week.

I disagree... some scripture points out that God really doesn't care about these... what he wants is for us help injustice to cease in our world, to partner with him in caring for the sick, feeding the hungry, comforting those who mourn, reaching out to widows (those who cannot provide for themselves and do not have anyone else who is caring for them). How many of our worship gatherings do this? How many of our worship gatherings even encourage this?

While I am ranting... The thing that I wanted to bring up was my struggle with the current trend of Worship Leader Magazine. It's focus is more and more on technology and how to use technology to produce an awe-inspiring service. And we call this worship...? I struggle with that. Yes I am for technology. I love technology. And I love when we can use technology in ways that support Jesus' kingdom. But recently it seems so consumerist. Buy this gagdet and this gizmo and your worship experience will be great. Come on! We know that if we need all of this to worship that we are missing out on the worship God created us for.

I guess, what I would like to see and read is more about worship is what we do with the every day life... it's either that or we need to change the name of the magazine... 'Gizmos for worship gatherings' or 'music leading through the use of multi-sensory technology for worship gatherings.'

Worship Conversation - 1 Cor. 14:1-5

2008-03-13T21:19:00.002-04:00

Scripture: 1 Corinthians 14:1-5
1Follow the way of love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy. 2For anyone who speaks in a tongue^[a] does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit.^[b] 3But everyone who prophesies speaks to men for their strengthening, encouragement and comfort. 4He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church. 5I would like every one of you to speak in tongues,^[c] but I would rather have you prophesy. He who prophesies is greater than one who speaks in tongues,^[d] unless he interprets, so that the church may be edified.

In any gathering of the church Paul points out something very important. Please also read previous chapters in 1 Corinthians. Notice that Paul spends a lot of time on the subject of the church being a 'loving' community. In Chapter 13, Paul doesn't waist too many words. Each word is poignant and poetic trying to capture the heart of God who demonstrates his love for us through Christ and Paul opens saying, "Follow the way of love". And 'love' is 'agape' in Greek. Agape is the kind of love that lays itself down for the sake of another. Agape is the unconditional love that forgives even those people who are doing you the most harm. Agape love cries out in the middle of the crucifixion saying, "Father forgive them." Agape love is the kind of love that even though one has the power to wipe his enemies out; he/she doesn't. Instead, agape love continues to seek and find ways of redemption and reconciliation.

Then, Paul begins a conversation on leadership and worship and how we are to behave when we meet with one another. Something to note he doesn't specify the size of gathering, nor does specify the exact order of a gathering, and even though he mentions some things, it's almost as though he leaves a lot of room for variety. In fact, we should also note where these gatherings take place. They do not appear to take place in any type of 'temple'. So where do they occur?

This passage also begins with talk on gifts (talents, abilities). One thing I noticed is the word 'spiritual' in front of gift. It's really one word, 'Pneumatikos'. Pneuma means breath or wind in connection to God it is the wind or breath of the God. "Tikos" could be things, gifts. Another way to think about it may be in the sense that these are 'gifts', 'talents', 'abilities' being used in accordance to the wind of God or the way in which God intended things to work. Another way, these gifts are being used in accordance with the flow of the very nature of who God is. Something I also noticed in studying this word is that this word is in connection with the 'rational' portion of a person. In other words, these are gifts that are intentionally and rationally being used by people. We are not taken over by some strange spirit. For Paul all of this happens out of the realness of life. Paul is not about the hyper-spiritual gifts that many people are pushing these days. Paul is seeking to move us towards using our mental and physical abilities to work according to the essence of who God is.

It seems that there were some unique things happening with the ability to speak in other languages. One of the things that I like to note is that Paul doesn't knock people down for using various languages. However, I must also note that Paul puts the most emphasis on speaking in a language that everyone can understand. IN this version the word is translated Prophesy.

Prophesy is a word that is greatly misunderstood. I think we often hyper-spiritualize prophesy. It almost becomes this spiritual state of being in which the person has no control over herself. This is not what Paul is speaking about. He is saying, "say something that helps people truly get who God is and who we are called to be." One meaningful word is more valuable than ocean of gibberish or non-sense.

I encourage you to go to StudyLight.org's interlinear Bible. Check out the various words that Paul uses. We are so used to hearing our English words that we often miss what an Author of the Biblical text is really trying to say. All I can say is that I am on the journey.

Please Comment. Argue with me, or agree with me, help me to see more clearly.

Worship Conversation 1 Corinthians 14

2008-03-13T21:16:00.000-04:00

1 Corinthians 14 is an interesting passage where the Apostle Paul presents an Orderly form of Worship for gatherings.

I will be presenting some of my thoughts in a future blog. I encourage you to read the passage and share your thoughts about how it relates to worship gatherings in the 21st century?

(the following passage is copied from www.biblegateway.org)

1 Corinthians 14 (NIV)

Gifts of Prophecy and Tongues

1Follow the way of love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy. 2For anyone who speaks in a tongue^[a] does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit.^[b] 3But everyone who prophesies speaks to men for their strengthening, encouragement and comfort. 4He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the church. 5I would like every one of you to speak in tongues,^[c] but I would rather have you prophesy. He who prophesies is greater than one who speaks in tongues,^[d] unless he interprets, so that the church may be edified.

6Now, brothers, if I come to you and speak in tongues, what good will I be to you, unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction? 7Even in the case of lifeless things that make sounds, such as the flute or harp, how will anyone know what tune is being played unless there is a distinction in the notes? 8Again, if the trumpet does not sound a clear call, who will get ready for battle? 9So it is with you. Unless you speak intelligible words with your tongue, how will anyone know what you are saying? You will just be speaking into the air. 10Undoubtedly there are all sorts of languages in the world, yet none of them is without meaning. 11If then I do not grasp the meaning of what someone is saying, I am a foreigner to the speaker, and he is a foreigner to me. 12So it is with you. Since you are eager to have spiritual gifts, try to excel in gifts that build up the church.

13For this reason anyone who speaks in a tongue should pray that he may interpret what he says. 14For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. 15So what shall I do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will also pray with my mind; I will sing with my spirit, but I will also sing with my mind. 16If you are praising God with your spirit, how can one who finds himself among those who do not understand^[e] say "Amen" to your thanksgiving, since he does not know what you are saying? 17You may be giving thanks well enough, but the other man is not edified.

18I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. 19But in the church I would rather speak five intelligible words to instruct others than ten thousand words in a tongue.

20Brothers, stop thinking like children. In regard to evil be infants, but in your thinking be adults. 21In the Law it is written:
"Through men of strange tongues
and through the lips of foreigners
I will speak to this people,
but even then they will not listen to me,"^[f] says the Lord.

22Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is for believers, not for unbelievers. 23So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and some who do not understand^[g] or some unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind? 24But if an unbeliever or someone who does not understand^[h]comes in while everybody is prophesying, he will be convinced by all that he is a sinner and will be judged by all, 25and the secrets of his heart will be laid bare. So he will fall down and worship God, exclaiming, "God is really among you!"

Orderly Worship

26What then shall we say, brothers? When you come together, everyone has a hymn, or a word of instruction, a revelation, a tongue or an interpretation. All of these must be done for the strengthening of the church. 27If anyone speaks in a tongue, two—or at the most three—should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. 28If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and God.

29Two or three prophets should speak, and the others should weigh carefully what is said. 30And if a revelation comes to someone who is sitting down, the first speaker should stop. 31For you can all prophesy in turn so that everyone may be instructed and encouraged. 32The spirits of prophets are subject to the control of prophets. 33For God is not a God of disorder but of peace.
As in all the congregations of the saints, 34women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. 35If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church.

36Did the word of God originate with you? Or are you the only people it has reached? 37If anybody thinks he is a prophet or spiritually gifted, let him acknowledge that what I am writing to you is the Lord's command. 38If he ignores this, he himself will be ignored.^[i]

39Therefore, my brothers, be eager to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues. 40But everything should be done in a fitting and orderly way.

Footnotes:

1 Corinthians 14:2 Or another language; also in verses 4, 13, 14, 19, 26 and 27
1 Corinthians 14:2 Or by the Spirit
1 Corinthians 14:5 Or other languages; also in verses 6, 18, 22, 23 and 39
1 Corinthians 14:5 Or other languages; also in verses 6, 18, 22, 23 and 39
1 Corinthians 14:16 Or among the inquirers
1 Corinthians 14:21 Isaiah 28:11,12
1 Corinthians 14:23 Or some inquirers
1 Corinthians 14:24 Or or some inquirer
1 Corinthians 14:38 Some manuscripts If he is ignorant of this, let him be ignorant

How do we design a structure within our worship ministry which allows for the emerging spiritual gifts?

2007-10-10T11:58:00.002-04:00

At New Hope we currently have one worship team that provides music for the majority of our worship services.

One hang up that perplexes me on this form is that being part of a worship ministry team consumes much time. What I am seeking the answer to is: How might we do worship ministry in a way that truly values people for who they are? And gives these people plenty of room to explore ways of connecting with real people outside of church?

At this point I don't even know if I am asking the right questions.

My hope is that we may light fires of creativity that are expressed through gathered worship experiences and the sent nature of who God has called the church to be.

My heart is to engage and connect people with Jesus, his church and his mission.

Our worship is to reflect who God is in the world. God has not left the neighborhood. We are Jesus' flesh and blood to the world. And our worship, I think is to be holy ground for celebrating the kingdom come that is continually coming.

We bring heaven to earth by living Jesus' way.

PS I am still being formed. I am still a pot on the potter's wheel becoming what the creator is designing me to be.

The Ancient One (from American Indian Mythology)

2007-10-10T11:45:00.000-04:00

The Ancient One

by Bearwalker

Ancient One sat in the shade of his tree in front of his cave. Red People came to him and he said to Red People, "Tell me your vision."

And Red People answered, "The elders have told us to pray in this manner, and that manner, and it is important that only we pray as we have been taught for this has been handed down to us by the elders."

"Hmmmm," said the Ancient One.

Then Black People came to him and he said to Black People, "Tell me your vision."

And Black People answered, "Our mothers have said to go to this building and that building and pray in this manner and that manner. And our fathers have said to bow in this manner and that manner when we pray. And it is important that we do only this when we pray."

"Hmmmm," said the Ancient One.

Then Yellow People came to him and he said to Yellow People, "Tell me your vision."

And Yellow People answered, "Our teachers have told us to sit in this manner and that manner and to say this thing and that thing when we pray. And it is important that we do only this when we pray."

"Hmmmm," said the Ancient One.

Then White People came to him and he said to White People, "Tell me your vision."

And White People answered, "Our Book has told us to pray in this way and that way and to do this thing and that thing, and it is very important that we do this when we pray."

"Hmmmm," said the Ancient One.

Then Ancient One spoke to the Earth and said, "Have you given the people a vision?" And the Earth said, "Yes, a special gift for each one, but the people were so busy speaking and arguing about which way is right they could not see the gift I gave each one of them." And the Ancient One asked same question of Water and Fire and Air and got the same answer. Then Ancient One asked Animal, and Bird, and Insect, and Tree, and Flower, and Sky, and Moon, and Sun, and Stars, and all of the other Spirits and each told him the same.

Ancient One thought this was very sad. He called Red People, Black People, Yellow People, and White People to him and said to them. "The ways taught to you by your Elders, and your Mothers and Fathers, and Teachers, and Books are sacred. It is good that you respect those ways, for they are the ways of your ancestors. But the ancestors no longer walk on the Face of the Earth Mother. You have forgotten your own Vision. Your Vision is right for you but no one else. Now each of you must pray for your own Visions, and be still enough to see them, so you can follow the way of the heart. It is a hard way. It is a good way.

-------

I don't necessarily agree with the final statements of this article, but I believe there is some truth in what is said here.

We realize that tradition and religion are valuable to people... but how much more valuable is love. I believe that this is, in a way, what Jesus speaks about. Jesus always called people to look beyond tradition and religion and get to the heart of what it means to be people created in the image of God. Jesus presented a way of living that respected all people and yet called people to live in better relationship with God, self, others and God's creation.

What do you think? Do you think Jesus was promoting a set of dos and donts or was he truly promoting a lifestyle that somehow included everyone?

I realize that this question is slightly loaded, but I am going to take it a step farther...

How pertinent is Jesus in the grand scheme of things? Is he just another dead ancestor?

And since he is not just another dead ancestor, what does that mean for us and all people? Why is Jesus' way beyond anything else ever? And what was Jesus really about?

Quotes

2007-10-05T14:38:00.000-04:00

From Emerging Churches by Eddie Gibes and Ryan K. Bolger.

"However, after three hundred years of cognitive-based Christianity, we have entered a new era in which such a reductionistic focus on mind has been discredited by the culture at large. . . The Reformation focused on the spoken Word, while postmodern worship embraces the experienced Word" (78).

I remember a book entitled "Don't Check Your Brains at the Door." It's interesting, we seemed to have 'progressed' to saying don't check your body at the door.

As I am thinking about this... Gathered worship should be a psychosomatic communal spiritual experience.

Psycho = mind and soma = body meaning a mind-body experience.

Communal represents the idea of being connected with others. A gathered worship service should some how help me to be more connected with other humans than less connected.

Spiritual, as I am using it here represents a deeper connection with God and the person we were created to be.

In other words a corporate gathering for worship should engage me physically, mentally, and be emotionally connecting me to God, self and others. I should leave such an experience more in unity with God, self, others and God's creation.

Reading Worship Leader Magazine

2007-09-20T23:36:00.000-04:00

Today, I received my worship leader magazine. I highly recommend it and the accompanying product SongDiscovery. I've been reading/listening to it for years. It tends to stretch one forward and reach backwards connecting one to the roots of worship arts and moving one forward to what comes next in order to help the next generation to connect with God.

I found this magazine to be full of ups and downs. The article with Vicky Beeching was really awesome and then my heart saddened. She talked about people connecting to acts of service to others throughout the whole article, that we need to be connected not just to music but to the poor as well. At one point she says, "I think we actually have lost sight of what worship even is. I've been going back to the Old Testament and looking at Isaiah, Malachi, Amos. And God makes it very clear. He says, 'I'm wearied by your festivals; I'm wearied by the noises of singing. This is the worship I desire. I want you to serve the fatherless, the widowed and the orphan.' He makes it very clear what we're supposed to do." -- To this I give many kudos. That's awesome. That's right on the money. But later she writes about worship as more than just singing songs and lives that would be so pure that we're actually inviting God to come in, in his power and in his glory--inhabiting the praise of his people." This much is good it's what comes next that troubles me and seems to contradict what she said earlier... She writes, "And I think that when that happens, that's when the lost will come in. People talk about crossover music all the time. But my heart for worship is that the crossover would be backwards. When God shows up in our churches, the lost will be banging on the church door. Because they'll know that's where the true spiritual experience is." That part saddens me.

I realize that she only had a limited amount of space, but this ending seems drastically off. First, the lost banging on the church doors sounds more of an attractional than missional mindset. Is the goal of mission to attract people to our church, to get something out of them? Or is missional about Christ-like self-giving love on behalf of the other. The second thought, "because they'll know that's where the true spiritual experience is." This is a huge leap. Do we really want to say that the 'true spiritual experience' is in some building that we mistakenly call the church? Jesus did spend some time in synagogues, but it intrigues me, if we are following Jesus and seeking to be like him, we must recognize that Jesus revealed true spiritual experiences in the midst of all of life. Whether Jesus was at a wedding, or a tax collectors' party, or a Pharisee's house, or among the poor, or among the lepers, or being touched by a woman who had bled for years everything was a part of the truly spiritual to Jesus. Jesus spoke to a woman by a well and said, "True worshipers, the kind of worshipers God wants, will worship neither here nor there, but will worship in spirit and truth." If I understand this, and I may not, our attitudes and actions will be intimately tied together as we live a Jesus-kind of life. And it is this kind of life that realize that my every action has a spiritual connotation to that I bear my worship (loving service) to God. And my best way to show love to God is by loving my neighbors, even the ones who are my enemy.

What do you think?

NFL Theme Song

2007-08-16T16:20:00.001-04:00

Well, if this worked... here is a listening example of the NFL Theme Song.

Welcome to New Hope Community Worship Blog

2007-08-14T17:12:00.000-04:00

Over the next few months this site may become the home of conversations about corporate worship at NHCC.